What's new
By:
Filters

BMW R1300GS

JimVonBaden said:
YOU wouldn't, because you don't know the difference.
Click to expand...
WTF? I know the difference between FREE and 40 bucks!

I hate to say it in a open Forum but BoxFlyer is by far, the best of the best when it comes to Self Service of BMW motorcycles. And he does it for FREE! Your DVD is a dying resource that cost 40 bucks. Why would ANYONE pay you, for information that is free?

I lent you my 1200 cam tools to do your video. I tried to support you. Now when the rubber meets the road you want to insult me? Fine no worry's but know your DVD is a Dinosaur that cost 40 bucks. And it will never stand up to a warranty claim.

I rode to Boxflyer's house and demonstrated a cam timing to him and he just ran with it. Yes it was a long trip from PA to RI and back in a day, but it was well worth the trip. He also produces ALL the Cam Timing tools you need to do the work. From what I understand he is in production with a CNC shop now to improve the tools. He is a very sharp cookie to figure out how to make those tools. And he is METICULOUS in his work and videos. He is not a rattle can, and polish kind of guy.

And AGAIN his videos are FREE!

You can view them here: 1250 Boxflyer Videos
 
LCGS said:
So since they already denied stators, and cam and followers, how does that work?
Click to expand...
The stators and cam/followers were not denied as a warranty repair because the owners tried to repair them themselves, they were denied because the bike warranty expired.

Unless an owner damaged the stator, cam/follower when trying to repair it (while the bike is still under warranty), I don't see how BMW could deny that repair.
 
Last edited:
Callisto224 said:
The stators and cam/followers were not denied as a warranty repair because the owners tried to repair them themselves, they were denied because the bike warranty expired.

Unless an owner damaged the stator, cam/follower when trying to repair it (while the bike is still under warranty), I don't see how BMW could deny that repair.
Click to expand...
Yes I know. But if they denied a warranty on a failed part, that an owner has no chance of messing up in anything they do, what are they going to do to a self serviced bike in warranty?

The stator and cams should be a replacement free of charge. They are inferior and poorly made parts. But yet there is no coverage for those defective parts.

I do not think BMW cares about it's customers at all either in, or out of warranty. I think they have pulled the perfect coup. You get no information so you MUST use a BMW NA Dealer to have warranty coverage.

It is a blessing they finally saw the drive shaft as a liability and potential law suite, so the stepped up.

I just hate they have ruined the small business model for independent shops. And that you pay with all the goodies like 28K for a bike, and then can not spin a wrench on them because you do not have the information to do so. And then you have to go to a dealer who charges 110@hour for labor. Just not fair!

I have and will continue to vote with my wallet. I have the means and want for a newer bike, and in particular a 1300, but not without a service DVD.

My point in all this is NO BMW NA Dealer is going to honor a warranty claim on a self serviced bike. Their out is the information has not been released through BMW channels so no matter what information you have they will say it cant be trusted as they have not released the information to the public. It is so easy for them to do now that they have cut out Service DVD's. Any information you have will be pirated, or copyrighted to BMW.

The 1300 is a new beast and with all the changes to it I am sure torque specs are going to change. New paralever, new drive line, new frame, new transmission mounted under the motor. It is going to be some time before all that comes to light. And I am wondering if the cam tools are going to work from the 1250 on the 1300? Just too many unknowns for me to spend the money and not be able to service it myself.

If there were a service DVD I would order a 1300 or a R18 on Tuesday when they open.

I do not hold any hope on anyone who thinks they can self service their bike and will win on a warranty claim. After that, no issues, as your on your own dime anyway.
 
ZoomerP said:
It's been established that LCGS knows he's right about warranties and service manuals, and that no amount of further discussion on that point will be fruitful.

With that out of the way, maybe we could hear more about the R1300GS.
Click to expand...
No worries.

Just wait and see how it plays out.

I just think people are feeling a false sense of security in non BMW NA released information in warranty.

Why the hell do you think they did it? What is a logical reason, other then forcing you into the dealers?

I am done on my rant for sure.
 
I'm pretty sure they'll have to do it. We have a law requiring the release of service information to non-dealers and consumers at a fair price too. "Right to Repair". BMW didn't have pannier bags either for this thing for the longest time. I think, before making a massive fuss, we might wait a bit longer for them to come up with the goods.
 
LCGS said:
The proof is you have NO BMW Authorized manual or information. IMHO that give every dealer the right that leads to denied warranty work.

Look we are still footing the bill for cams and followers, and crap stators which are inferior products. What chance do you think you have on a 1300?

I see this coming into play on the new 1300 motor. With the transmission on the bottom of the motor and a shorter drive line.

Anything could have changed. From TQ values to valve clearance settings. I also wonder if cam timing tools are going to be different?

I am not against self serviced bikes as I am one! But I have a antique motor in my 17.5 GS. It is well proofed out and I have factory authorized information. That is why it never has seen a dealer.

Next time it does it will get a new driveshaft as I am going to run it to 36K before I schedule it in.

I am not in any way saying anything bad against Jim or Brad, as after 3 years you can use that information to maintain your bike worry free.

My rant is always that BMW has screwed every owner who turns their own wrench, and every independent shop out there. It is a money grab by BMW and its band of Merry Dealers. Give to the rich, so they can get richer.
Click to expand...
What I'm trying to say is that the Magnuson-Moss Act requires that manufacturers supply repair and maintenance info. BMW is violating law by not offering the manual. I think, if whoever decided this policy gets talked to by some lawyers, the DVD will become available at parts counters. Your Humble Opinion is not law. I know an organization that will be interested in this. They may sue BMW if they don't change their policy about the DVDs. They are all about Right to Repair. Class action? We'll see.
 
LCGS said:
No worries.

Just wait and see how it plays out.

I just think people are feeling a false sense of security in non BMW NA released information in warranty.

Why the hell do you think they did it? What is a logical reason, other then forcing you into the dealers?

I am done on my rant for sure.
Click to expand...

Of course it's to force you into the dealers but it violates the law. I can't believe someone has authority to make the policy and doesn't know US law or didn't run it through a legal department. I guess dumber things have happened. There will be a suit for sure, I'd say. This is pretty blatant.
 
LCGS said:
Yes I know. But if they denied a warranty on a failed part, that an owner has no chance of messing up in anything they do, what are they going to do to a self serviced bike in warranty?

The stator and cams should be a replacement free of charge. They are inferior and poorly made parts. But yet there is no coverage for those defective parts.

I do not think BMW cares about it's customers at all either in, or out of warranty. I think they have pulled the perfect coup. You get no information so you MUST use a BMW NA Dealer to have warranty coverage.

It is a blessing they finally saw the drive shaft as a liability and potential law suite, so the stepped up.

I just hate they have ruined the small business model for independent shops. And that you pay with all the goodies like 28K for a bike, and then can not spin a wrench on them because you do not have the information to do so. And then you have to go to a dealer who charges 110@hour for labor. Just not fair!

I have and will continue to vote with my wallet. I have the means and want for a newer bike, and in particular a 1300, but not without a service DVD.

My point in all this is NO BMW NA Dealer is going to honor a warranty claim on a self serviced bike. Their out is the information has not been released through BMW channels so no matter what information you have they will say it cant be trusted as they have not released the information to the public. It is so easy for them to do now that they have cut out Service DVD's. Any information you have will be pirated, or copyrighted to BMW.

The 1300 is a new beast and with all the changes to it I am sure torque specs are going to change. New paralever, new drive line, new frame, new transmission mounted under the motor. It is going to be some time before all that comes to light. And I am wondering if the cam tools are going to work from the 1250 on the 1300? Just too many unknowns for me to spend the money and not be able to service it myself.

If there were a service DVD I would order a 1300 or a R18 on Tuesday when they open.

I do not hold any hope on anyone who thinks they can self service their bike and will win on a warranty claim. After that, no issues, as your on your own dime anyway.
Click to expand...
It's illegal for them to hide information from owners or non-dealer shops. It's illegal for them to deny warranty based on the fact that the owner doesn't have access to official BMW information that's kept secret. So, BMW should be sued. This is not legal to do.
 
Unfortunately I think it's going to take a law suit for BMW to comply with the Magnuson-Moss Act and it will most likely take a few years to get resolved.
 
LCGS said:
Yes I know. But if they denied a warranty on a failed part, that an owner has no chance of messing up in anything they do, what are they going to do to a self serviced bike in warranty?

The stator and cams should be a replacement free of charge. They are inferior and poorly made parts. But yet there is no coverage for those defective parts.

I do not think BMW cares about it's customers at all either in, or out of warranty. I think they have pulled the perfect coup. You get no information so you MUST use a BMW NA Dealer to have warranty coverage.

It is a blessing they finally saw the drive shaft as a liability and potential law suite, so the stepped up.

I just hate they have ruined the small business model for independent shops. And that you pay with all the goodies like 28K for a bike, and then can not spin a wrench on them because you do not have the information to do so. And then you have to go to a dealer who charges 110@hour for labor. Just not fair!

I have and will continue to vote with my wallet. I have the means and want for a newer bike, and in particular a 1300, but not without a service DVD.

My point in all this is NO BMW NA Dealer is going to honor a warranty claim on a self serviced bike. Their out is the information has not been released through BMW channels so no matter what information you have they will say it cant be trusted as they have not released the information to the public. It is so easy for them to do now that they have cut out Service DVD's. Any information you have will be pirated, or copyrighted to BMW.

The 1300 is a new beast and with all the changes to it I am sure torque specs are going to change. New paralever, new drive line, new frame, new transmission mounted under the motor. It is going to be some time before all that comes to light. And I am wondering if the cam tools are going to work from the 1250 on the 1300? Just too many unknowns for me to spend the money and not be able to service it myself.

If there were a service DVD I would order a 1300 or a R18 on Tuesday when they open.

I do not hold any hope on anyone who thinks they can self service their bike and will win on a warranty claim. After that, no issues, as your on your own dime anyway.
Click to expand...
You said it yourself, BMW doesn't seem to care about it's customers. Surprisingly, I was interested in buying a BMW recently. After years and years of horror stories and seeing friends struggle to keep their's on the road, why the hell would I want one? Not sure, but the F900R looked fun and was cheap enough to take a gamble on.

That $8,500 bike has a $5,000 "electronics package" and the dealership won't order me one without it. That's ridiculous. Especially considering the bike itself is underpowered and overweight ( and not by a little bit) compared to it's competitors.

Forget BMW, get you a Japanese machine and enjoy a better life at a fraction of the cost. Japanese culture pushes them to be proud of their work and to produce the best things they can. BMW is selling lifestyle machines and membership to the club.

BMW fans, don't crucify me. But you gotta admit that in recent years that BMW and Triumph are working hard to follow in Harley Davidson's footsteps of selling heritage over innovation. I'll take the cheap, light, dependable, powerful Jap bike every time.
 
Shinyribs said:
You said it yourself, BMW doesn't seem to care about it's customers. Surprisingly, I was interested in buying a BMW recently. After years and years of horror stories and seeing friends struggle to keep their's on the road, why the hell would I want one? Not sure, but the F900R looked fun and was cheap enough to take a gamble on.

That $8,500 bike has a $5,000 "electronics package" and the dealership won't order me one without it. That's ridiculous. Especially considering the bike itself is underpowered and overweight ( and not by a little bit) compared to it's competitors.

Forget BMW, get you a Japanese machine and enjoy a better life at a fraction of the cost. Japanese culture pushes them to be proud of their work and to produce the best things they can. BMW is selling lifestyle machines and membership to the club.

BMW fans, don't crucify me. But you gotta admit that in recent years that BMW and Triumph are working hard to follow in Harley Davidson's footsteps of selling heritage over innovation. I'll take the cheap, light, dependable, powerful Jap bike every time.
Click to expand...
Vote with your wallet. That is the only thing that any Brand of anything understands.
 
JimVonBaden said:
Probably not, though the truth is most people are well under 6'.
Click to expand...

That is true, but it's a shame that many bikes, if not most, are built for people around 5'7".

I finally got to go look at the new R1300GS. It is much smaller than the behemoth that the GS Adventures have become. It is quite a bit more compact than my R1250RS as well, but the RS has the longer wheelbase for stability at speed and the GS is the all rounder bike. I did not like the seat at all. It was smaller than the stock seat from my RS and seemed to push me forward. I did like the balance of the bike but the overall quality "feel" of the bike seemed less than before but I did not ride it so what do I really know. And as suspected, the knee and hip angles on my RS are ever so slightly more open than the new GS.

The bottom line for me, there is little to no chance I would get the new GS priced in the upper $20K's without storage when my '21 RS is set up for me ergonomically and has storage. My RS has 20K miles on it and is only worth around $9K if traded, maybe $13K if I sold it. There is no way it's worth half of the new GS to me.

Regardless, the new GS is a nice bike that seems like a better direction from how the old ones ballooning in size and cost.

image3.jpeg


image1.jpeg
 
Last edited:
TJT said:
That is true, but it's a shame that many bikes, if not most, are built for people around 5'7".

I finally got to go look at the new R1300GS. It is much smaller than the behemoth that the GS Adventures have become. It is quite a bit more compact than my R1250RS as well, but the RS has the longer wheelbase for stability at speed and the GS is the all rounder bike. I did not like the seat at all. I did like the balance of the bike but the overall quality feel of the bike seemed less than before but I did not ride it so what do I really know. And as suspected, the knee and hip angles on my RS are ever so slightly more open than the new GS.

The bottom line for me, there is little to no chance I would get the new GS priced in the upper $20K's without storage when my '21 RS is set up for me ergonomically and has storage. My RS has 20K miles on it and is only worth around $9K if traded, maybe $13K if I sold it. There is no way it's worth half of the new GS to me.

Regardless, the new GS is a nice bike that seems like a better direction from how the old ones ballooning in size and cost.

image3.jpeg


image1.jpeg
Click to expand...
I was talking to a BMW salesperson about the new R1300GS (which happened to be in the parking lot) and he felt the seat was pretty bad. I looked at the bike and the seat did look pretty narrow and plank-like but I didn't bother to sit on it because it's not something I'll probably ever buy. Price + bags + windscreen + seat + other farkles = unjustifiable marginal utility of my money. I don't know. I'm sure it'll check the boxes for a lot of riders.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom Back Refresh