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Garmin vs Phone

Which one sucks less?


  • Total voters
    76
I recently switched to a Cardio after using Sena for years, this one has the voice commands. Regarding playing music in your helmet, I should have done this years ago, unless I'm setting something up like paring I don't touch the unit except to turn it on or off, otherwise I tell it what to do and it works very well for me. That functionality is easy for a phone. There's nothing about the remote screen that's insurmountable or unproven, it'd just take someone with the skills willing to tackle it. I do know from reading articles, the whole Android Audio and Apple Car play effort is hamstrung by the Auto manufacturers. Right now those functions are constrained by what the manufacturers will allow on the screen which negatively affects the entire ecosystem because it's a one size fits all approach. Without those constraints I suspect both apps would be far different.
 
AndroidAuto allows for an ad-free use of Google Maps, which has real time traffic, speed trap, and construction updates, if not using it in offline mode.

Any number of phone based apps could just be mirrored onto a remote display, meaning that GPX files and the like would be just as useful, without modification.

Your peering concerns are valid, but nothing that seems insurmountable. With regard to AndroidAuto, I plug a late model Pixel phone into a late model Honda, set permissions once, and it just works.

A company like Google/Alphabet seems ideal for exploiting the paired screen concept. They're trying to gain phone market share, they already dabble in tablets/laptops, and they own a popular OS. They also have funding to support the growth of such a product, and they'd get the jump on their competitors with a Pixel-centric environment. Apple could also do it for similar reasons.


I've used android auto on a variety of recent model rental cars- Chevy is sometimes the worst by far automatically starting media and no way to prevent it either in Android or in the car system. AndroidAuto seems to fight with bluetooth audio and USB cabling- unless I'm mistaken it won't run over in-car wifi for example... and once the usb receptacle and/or plug starts wearing out then there is lots of trouble with reliability.

Now if this mysterious gizmo connected by bluetooth and ran over it- or via wifi- leaving the usb connector free and perhaps wireless charging of the phone could be arranged then its getting reasonable. I've had way too many usb connector problems to take a wired solution seriously.

Once waze starting pushing ads and having witnessed over 10 years of lock-north-up not working properly in google maps I lost all faith in google.
 
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I don't believe Bluetooth would have the bandwidth for screen mirroring, but wifi in such close proximity may.

USB-C is a fairly robust connector, in my experience. If that's actually a hurdle, a cable that utilized a magnetically connected adapter on the phone end could be used. Plug the adapter into the phone once, and use the breakaway mag connection; the remote display could have a native mag connector. That's already available.

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I haven't utilized AndroidAuto in many vehicles. Like I said, I've had no problems using a Pixel 6 phone over a USB-C connection with an OEM Honda (made by Pioneer, I believe) head unit. From what you and Ridefreak have said, I can certainly see automakers mucking things up in an effort to protect their profitable in-house solutions. If an industry leader like Apple, Google, or Microsoft pushed past those problems with their own solutions, maybe automakers would be pushed away from their proprietary protectionism.

From what you said about Waze, that's a Waze problem.

If you haven't tried Google Maps lately, you may be surprised by the progress made in the last few years. I still have a Garmin dash GPS because I like the way it handles lane designations in high traffic areas. At the time I purchased that Garmin, Google Maps lacked that feature, and the general interface didn't work as well as the Garmin unit, as you said. Today, Google is simply better, with more up-to-date maps, POI searches, and lane designations. My Garmin offers voice command as does my phone, but the phone based search capability far outclasses the relatively meager library stored in the Garmin.

The main advantage of a dedicated Garmin unit over a phone is in areas that lack mobile network coverage over wide areas when you didn't download maps for offline use, and those areas are becoming ever more rare in the continental U.S. Outside that area, I'd probably want my navigation device to use stored maps, and there are several ways to make that happen with a phone, too.


Wifi certainly has plenty of bandwidth- its not like we're doing high resolutions or high frame rates to mirror a phone screen- and its more robust than bluetooth for sure. But AndroidAuto doesn't seem to use it, requiring a usb cable. That magnetic usb-c thing is good for a laugh but not what I'd call rugged- as an openner it needs stuff like


and the equivalent male connector- with water resistant seals and positive retention. I don't think any of the usual commercial usb-c connectors have that stuff anyway. Its just not a robust connector form, though its better than previous standards. Something like this would be much better


I'd be ecstatic if phones used these sorts of connectors instead of the current stuff; solid registration, waterproof or at least resistant, substantial strain relief, large wire gauge so no absurdities related to "charging cables".

But cables aside, any such solution really has to be wireless I think- my phone might be in a plastic bag in my jacket's inner pocket because of the pissing down rain and not in a position to be touched for 4+ hours, or maybe its not in a bag just getting damp from the water soaking in... that link to the display had better not flake out even once.

I use google maps all the time and am often frustrated by it flipping out of lock-north-up when going for directions and routing on the fly. Sorry I can't take seriously a navigation app that can't manage to honor its settings and keep north up and on seemingly random occasions fall back into pov routing; some occasional circumstance involving rotate during pinch zoom/scroll seems to do it. Sometimes just starting navigation somewhere will do it, then I have to tap that tiny little compass to get north-up again. Just to reduce annoyance I tried a few other of the map apps- they did manage north-up better but lack much of the google maps data and/or navigation abilities.

I've had frequent good luck with usb cable androidauto in various cars, and lots of bad luck. Way too many business trips with rental cars over the last few years has given me lots of experience with it. About the best I can say about it is that it works reasonably well until it doesn't- and when it doesn't theres no way to stop it from falling on its face. A marginal usb link is a primary cause of flakiness eg things are working fine until the phone slips sideways slightly disturbing the cable and the usb connection bounces up and down; android auto loses its mind and fiddling around is needed to bring it back. wifi-only androidauto would be a big help- but it doesn't exist afaik. If there were fallback modes, or settings to turn off features which are troublesome for some reason (eg disable audio) or just not desired (eg disable assistant), that would help a lot- but its pretty much all-or-nothing.

You're right about offline maps being helpful- way easier to do that on a phone... I suppose my issue is that the phone stuff is so often flaky and uncontrollable.
 
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I have been using Drive Mode Dashboard 2 recently. Actually running a beta version for testing. It is an excellent software setup for Android. I run an 8" Samaung Tab Active 2 Wi-Fi only that I bought used for $50. The software developer is one of the most responsive to questions, suggestions, wants, etc, that I have ever encountered. For some extra $$ they make a handlebar mounted controller that controls DMD2 and other apps as well.
Drive Mode Dashboard
 
Seriously thinking about ditching Garmin again. Bought a used Montana 610 from a good friend. Unit seems to work well with no issues, but my computer doesn't like it. Won't recognize it to hook up to Basecamp. Tried all the fixes I could find, changed cords and USB ports, brought Garmin Express on board all with no luck. Contacted Garmin to see about send it in for a check over and they don't service these anymore. They are however sending me a new data cable free of charge so kudos for that. But I'll be damned if I'm spending $500.00 for something that is obsolete in 5 years with no repair option.
 
Seriously thinking about ditching Garmin again. Bought a used Montana 610 from a good friend. Unit seems to work well with no issues, but my computer doesn't like it. Won't recognize it to hook up to Basecamp. Tried all the fixes I could find, changed cords and USB ports, brought Garmin Express on board all with no luck. Contacted Garmin to see about send it in for a check over and they don't service these anymore. They are however sending me a new data cable free of charge so kudos for that. But I'll be damned if I'm spending $500.00 for something that is obsolete in 5 years with no repair option.
How long do you wait for it to show up in Basecamp? My Montana 600 and XT both take a long time ( several minutes at times) to get synched to Basecamp.

Are you using a MAC or PC?
 
How long do you wait for it to show up in Basecamp? My Montana 600 and XT both take a long time ( several minutes at times) to get synched to Basecamp.

Are you using a MAC or PC?
PC. Windows 10 pro.

When I connect to the PC it kicks up a message something to the effect of USB drive not recognized. Device has malfunctioned.

When I dig into it a bit deeper, my computer gives a message of unknown USB device ( device descriptor request failed)
 
PC. Windows 10 pro.

When I connect to the PC it kicks up a message something to the effect of USB drive not recognized. Device has malfunctioned.

When I dig into it a bit deeper, my computer gives a message of unknown USB device ( device descriptor request f
PC. Windows 10 pro.

When I connect to the PC it kicks up a message something to the effect of USB drive not recognized. Device has malfunctioned.

When I dig into it a bit deeper, my computer gives a message of unknown USB device ( device descriptor request failed)
Good be a Garmin issue or something in the settings and software in the PC.

Have you tried connecting the 610 to a different computer, or a different GPS to your computer to determine which device is causing the issue?
 
Have you tried connecting the 610 to a different computer, or a different GPS to your computer to determine which device is causing the issue?
I haven't had the opportunity yet to hook up to another computer. The only other Garmin device I have is an Inreach mini 2. I was able to update it recently without issues.
 
I think that's one reason I'm aggravated, is I don't know if the 610 is the problem or the computer
 
I've solved update problems with late model Garmin devices by deleting cached files on my computer that were conflicting with the update process. If it's not going to cause more problems, you can try uninstalling Express and manually deleting the entire directory before reinstalling it.

You may have some luck searching the Garmin company forums for a solution. It's possible the Montana has an older version of software on it that's jamming up the process, requiring some additional steps to bring it current before you can communicate with it properly.

Garmin released an update for BaseCamp last month. Have you installed it?
I have not, I didn't realize they had done this. I'll do that.

I happen to be one of those guys that isn't terribly computer savvy. I know a little, probably enough to get me in trouble. And I only get on Basecamp 3-4 times a year, so there's some relearning that goes on.

Appreciate the ideas and help
 
It doesn't, I'm assuming since it doesn't recognize it in the USB port, a connection is taking place but being rejected.
 
Also contacted a friend of mine who is pretty savvy with Garmin that is going to help me with sorting whether it's my unit or my computer. Taking my 610 over to his place tomorrow evening to hook to his PC.
 
Just had a thought. The friend I bought it from used MAC and apple products. Any chance there could be something embedded in the 610 that would cause issues for PC?

Bear in mind I'm just spit balling here.
 
Definitely an avenue I may pursue. I'll do more testing before I go that direction. Not that there's anything stored on it currently that's important to me.
 
I have been using Drive Mode Dashboard 2 recently. Actually running a beta version for testing. It is an excellent software setup for Android. I run an 8" Samaung Tab Active 2 Wi-Fi only that I bought used for $50. The software developer is one of the most responsive to questions, suggestions, wants, etc, that I have ever encountered. For some extra $$ they make a handlebar mounted controller that controls DMD2 and other apps as well.
Drive Mode Dashboard
I have been utilizing DMD since it's original release. I was there when DMD2 was released as well. As a current beta user I have to say the latest iteration is phenomenal. I run the app on my Pixel phone, Samsung Tablet and Android radio in the vehicle. I am also blown away by the developer. He actually listen to users and implements improvements regularly. I really think running Drive Mode Dashboard on a Garmin Tread would be a near prefect setup. I would love to try it but the Tread is still a pricey piece of hardware for what it is.
 
Also contacted a friend of mine who is pretty savvy with Garmin that is going to help me with sorting whether it's my unit or my computer. Taking my 610 over to his place tomorrow evening to hook to his PC.
I'm very interested to see what the problem winds up being in case something like this happens to me in the future.
 
Seriously thinking about ditching Garmin again. Bought a used Montana 610 from a good friend. Unit seems to work well with no issues, but my computer doesn't like it. Won't recognize it to hook up to Basecamp. Tried all the fixes I could find, changed cords and USB ports, brought Garmin Express on board all with no luck. Contacted Garmin to see about send it in for a check over and they don't service these anymore. They are however sending me a new data cable free of charge so kudos for that. But I'll be damned if I'm spending $500.00 for something that is obsolete in 5 years with no repair option.
Did you have the Garmin cable with the small cylinder (RF Choke) made into it? Mine will not connect except when using that specific Garmin cable.
 
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