Milling & Machining

[MVI]

The problem with the cheap indicators, is that they work fantastic. They’re repeatable, and measure identically to name brand indicators.

Until the day they don’t.

Usually, within a year or so, they just stop being repeatable, or measuring accurately. But after a year of using them, you’ve come to trust them, and you won’t realize you’re screwed until it’s too late.

It all depends, I have had brand name tools go tits up on calibration too.

As a perk of the job at many places I worked, Engineers and Mechanics were required to have all dial indicators, etc cal checked and then marked with a QA Sticker semi annually.
They did not care if it was a $20 dial indicator/micrometer or a $200 dial indicator. But it had to pass cal.
Most of my stuffs is back from the 1990s, and it passed cal year after year.

Point is , you are kidding yourself to assume a high dollar indicator is always true if you dont cal check it annually

[edit] I'll add that of course the better stuffs, should be better.

 

[MVI]

Finally got me some alum stock for small parts on the mill.

Dammed Alum is expensive nowadays, 3 bucks a pound, 35#

 

[CDN Rick]

I learned this lesson with a pair of HF digital calipers. Before retiring I travelled a lot to do machine installations. I bought the HF calipers with the idea that I wouldn't be too torn up if they got stolen. I also wanted some that I could use for scribing Dykem without caring if I messed up the jaws. When I first got them they gave the same measurements as my Brown & Sharpes and I didn't plan to use them for anything too critical anyway. A few weeks in they started to be inconsistent in a way that was sometimes hard to spot - they'd be off about .01". Not enough that I could always spot it by eye but enough that I could no longer trust them. But being obstinate I kept them for scribing. Within a month they'd sometimes be off by over 0.1". That's when I pitched them.

Yup. Exact same thing happened to me…
Except it was .25ish. And it happened randomly depending on how fast I opened the callipers. Like you, I keep them now as “precision” scribes for Dykem marking, but with a large NFG sharpied onto the body of them.

I’ve been forced to learn vernier scales on my old polish made calipers while I save up for a set of Mitutoyo absolute.

Nice thing about vernier, is they are never wrong!

 

[CDN Rick]

It all depends, I have had brand name tools go tits up on calibration too.

As a perk of the job at many places I worked, Engineers and Mechanics were required to have all dial indicators, etc cal checked and then marked with a QA Sticker semi annually.
They did not care if it was a $20 dial indicator/micrometer or a $200 dial indicator. But it had to pass cal.
Most of my stuffs is back from the 1990s, and it passed cal year after year.

Point is , you are kidding yourself to assume a high dollar indicator is always true if you dont cal check it annually

[edit] I'll add that of course the better stuffs, should be better.

True to self is important when comparing to another measuring device.
Repeatability is more important when measuring a job with one tool.

I frequently test my tools off my gauge blocks. And always if something seems fishy. I know that isn’t the same as being calibrated in a lab, but it proves repeatability.

Many of my precision tools are 50-60 years old, and still test perfectly against the gauge blocks. I bought them for pennies from estate sales.

There are many tools I own, and would recommend people buy from China, but precision measuring tools aren’t among them.

Just my opinion. It’s worth what you paid for it.

 

[MVI]

You're not wrong.

Down here, three things hold their value. Tooling/Tools, Guns, & Trailers. I've been to many estates sales, when it comes to tools, they go for damned new new prices.

I recall you picked up a mill/lathe combo with a bunch of tooling at a very reasonable price. You just dont see deals like that often in Tejas.

 

[CDN Rick]

You're not wrong.

Down here, three things hold their value. Tooling/Tools, Guns, & Trailers. I've been to many estates sales, when it comes to tools, they go for damned new new prices.

I recall you picked up a mill/lathe combo with a bunch of tooling at a very reasonable price. You just dont see deals like that often in Tejas.

I paid pretty good money for the mill/lathe. And it’s been good to me, but I did steal a pickup bed load of boxes labeled Mitutoyu/Starrett/Lufkin/Butterfield/Gray/Nicholson/Brown&Sharpe for $300 USD once….

 

[MVI]

I paid pretty good money for the mill/lathe. And it’s been good to me, but I did steal a pickup bed load of boxes labeled Mitutoyu/Starrett/Lufkin/Butterfield/Gray/Nicholson/Brown&Sharpe for $300 USD once….

let me know when your leftovers are for sale

cheap

 

[MVI]

Rick was right as rain. I got brand new Starrett last word 711 dial indicator that was passed down to someone who did not need it.

 

[MVI]

I also got this lot of cutters, some custom goofy sized, and funny tapers. It thought the 10 degree conical cutter was kool and might useful someday.

I also really wanted that ball end mill, and the roughing mill at the far right.

$37 USD

Seller said The end mills and other parts here were ownedby a late friend who was a tool and die maker at Zenith Corp in the Chicagoland area.
A lot of his end mills were modified to cut a specific diameter, radius or taper in certain parts of a mold assembly.

 

[Shinyribs]

A friend is a CNC machinist ( family business) and gave me a box full of used endmills. Even with burnt corners they still sling aluminum like nobody's business. I'll need to go shopping to get better surface finishes, but I'm still deep in the learning stages. He mentioned having them sharpened. I might look in to that.

 

[MVI]

I now have close to 250 milling of various flutes and shapes. If I find a dull one, I'll mark it with red dykem and set it aside.
I'll have to seek out who can sharpen here, and the costs.
The last batch of end mills I bought, 50% of them looked brand spanking new.

 

[Punkinhead]

You might stop into a local small machine shop and ask who they have do their sharpening. A CNC only shop may just toss used cutters but a shop that still does some manual work will have someone swing through every few weeks or so to collect dull cutters and return sharpened ones. I have a local shop that lets me leave a box of cutters to be taken when their sharpening guy comes through. It's very affordable.

What's nice is they'll also do woodworking tools like table saw blades, jointer & planer blades.

 

[MVI]

You might stop into a local small machine shop and ask who they have do their sharpening. A CNC only shop may just toss used cutters but a shop that still does some manual work will have someone swing through every few weeks or so to collect dull cutters and return sharpened ones. I have a local shop that lets me leave a box of cutters to be taken when their sharpening guy comes through. It's very affordable.

What's nice is they'll also do woodworking tools like table saw blades, jointer & planer blades.

Great Idea

 

[MVI]

one more lot of cutters acquired, from former tool and die maker

 

[morsetaper2]

I'm not a fan of arguments like, "I don't use them a lot so I want cheap ones." One broken tap in an expensive, fragile part or in a hard to reach spot will teach you how false that notion is. A lot of cheap taps are carbon steel. Those are brittle and pretty much guaranteed to snap. At the very least buy HSS taps. If you mostly work on metric then you'll be miles ahead to buy individual high quality taps & dies because a set will be full of sizes you'll never use. Metric has done a much better job at standardizing than imperial. The overwhelming majority of metric threads are coarse, unlike imperial where fine, extra fine, and coarse threads are used willy nilly. So if you're mostly working on metric bikes and cars buy good quality course individual taps and dies in M4, M5, M6, and M8. Maybe M10 too. That will cover 95% or more of what you'll encounter. You'll occasionally run into fine metric threads, but those are rare enough that you can buy an individual tap or die when the situation arises. McMaster Carr is a good source of quality taps & dies.

If you are working on Japanese & European bikes get both fine and coarse taps for M8 & M10. That's were the Japanese & Euro standard thread to use, deviates. At least in my experience anyway.

 

[MVI]

Learned not to use a 2 flute mill on steel. I needed a 8.7mm mill and this one was 9mm

close enough for a pivot point

Learned my lesson and went to 4 flutes for the slotting operation

 

[gpounce]

2 flute cuts slots just fine, top pic looks like you're plunging tho. chip evacuation to avoid recuts is critical, flood coolant or a vacuum would help.

quite a bit of tool hanging out, would be preferable to minimize that.

 

[MVI]

Sage advise on the tool length, thanks

 

[MVI]

Winch Cable Tensioner Project turned out fine, and it works !

What did you do in your garage today?

All Bikes should be that simple Which I could say the same for my KTM RFS. Things got like three oil drain plugs 😂

advbikes.com

 

[psykown]

All right guys looking for a quick bit of advice, I've got a Tormach 440 and am planning on making two 6"x6" fixture plate with alternating dowel and threaded holes this weekend(ish). I dont expect this to be crazy accurate, its more of a learning experience. Is there anything that can be a big gotcha or is there any superuseful feature to include?